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16 hours ago, AstroBoii said:

The thing with adding hunger with the game is risky, it could work or not. The game itself is designed around "Get this, mine this, make this so you can take that so its easier to go there". In other words, a more "Gather to play more comfortably" An example is mining compound to craft teathers so you can travel longer distances away from your habitat without worrying about oxygen.

If a hunger mechanic is added, the game would take a turn, from "collect resources to have a bigger, cooler base and explore more planets and caves with less complications" to "you dont farm space carrots, you die, maggot".

Conclusion: If the game jumps from an Exploration - Crafting kind of genre to Survival - Exploration - Crafting genre it can turn out to be rather:

- Awesome

OR

- it can end up defeating the purpose of the original idea and kinda turn into minecraft with Sci-Fi technology and planet exploration.

Thank you for sharing your idea, I never thought of having a hunger mechanic in the game

The addition of hunger to Minecraft was hotly debated as  well, because up until then, it was more of a mining, exploration and building game then too. Until then food was used to heal a player who had taken damage, but there was no degradation of the health bar prior.

"The biggest controversial change to gameplay was the hunger system, which made health-management more complicated without adding any gameplay value. It also sparked debate over whether it had increased or decreased the overall difficulty of the game." - Hunger was added in Version 1.8

This also marked the turn into turning MInecraft into a PVP game, with enchantments, food buffs giving boost to players and armor and weapons that was previously unnecessary for survival as well.

Then hunger was essentially 'nerfed' anyway, as with later patches, it became way easier to survive first night(s), due to more food being found within the world, and the availablity of coal and such, so that hunger was easily overcome early in the game ( I don't remember every dying of hunger, but from poison spiders, yes), and just became a tedious bar that one had to munch a porkchop to satiate every 10 mins or so.

This is why I stick with my argument that the management of both oxygen and energy, and interweaving the reliance of each resource with each other, while needing both to manage, mining, powered items, and progress would be something far better to spend development time on, rather than a typically badly implemented 'hunger' mechanic added to the game 'for the sake of appearing to be survival'.

Hell, even 'hunger' in a game like Rust is trivial, as the whole aim of the game now is PVP deathmatch, and since food is also highly available in the game in many forms, it too has become a  moot point in the game - as surviving other people's bullets has become the focus more .

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On 9.1.2017 at 4:26 AM, Frigidman said:

....

Dont forget sleep... 

Exactly what I thought -.-

no hunger please.

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Personally I would love the challenge of growing foods in an unfriendly environment as well a discovering native food sources. To me, this adds to immersion and is not a chore at all. It would be great if there were multiple options to choose for food sources. Maybe space rations for those that don't want to farm and prepare meals. You could find these in the crashed shuttles and spaceships. Maybe you would complete objectives to get a supply pod with rations like the bubble pyramids that show up occasionally. Then, those that want to bother with farming ect could pursue the challenge of cultivation

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Yes to hunger. we need it for 

 

 

I M M E R S I O N

 

 

cant wait for different mods so we can cook food aswell. like tendies.

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41 minutes ago, PilotChan said:

Yes to hunger. we need it for 

 

 

I M M E R S I O N

 

 

cant wait for different mods so we can cook food aswell. like tendies.

Assuming you have read this entire thread, and understand all the arguments for and against this...

How does adding a hunger mechanic add immersion? (Please explain)

Couldn't, for yourself, not eat for 24 hours, so you feel hunger pangs while playing Astroneer, solve that immersion problem for you?

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11 minutes ago, ent|ty said:

Assuming you have read this entire thread, and understand all the arguments for and against this...

How does adding a hunger mechanic add immersion? (Please explain)

Couldn't, for yourself, not eat for 24 hours, so you feel hunger pangs while playing Astroneer, solve that immersion problem for you?

Nope. It's not just hunger, it's food, farming and cultivation that goes along with the hunger. One of the biggest challenges of colonizing a planet is creating a renewable source of food and water.

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3 minutes ago, finnrose said:

Nope. It's not just hunger, it's food, farming and cultivation that goes along with the hunger. One of the biggest challenges of colonizing a planet is creating a renewable source of food and water.

I was hoping for more fleshed out counter-arguments, rather than the typical "Yes, add hunger" or "No, do not add hunger", but with no supporting statements to sell their positions.

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Just now, ent|ty said:

I was hoping for more fleshed out counter-arguments, rather than the typical "Yes, add hunger" or "No, do not add hunger", but with no supporting statements to sell their positions.

Ah, I see. I hope my answer provided a bit of that.

 

I think that many people who are fans of traditional sim and sandbox type games enjoy the hunger mechanic because it adds a challenge. For me, it's not necessarily the hunger itself but the gameplay that goes hand-in hand with it.

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30 minutes ago, ent|ty said:

Assuming you have read this entire thread, and understand all the arguments for and against this...

How does adding a hunger mechanic add immersion? (Please explain)

Couldn't, for yourself, not eat for 24 hours, so you feel hunger pangs while playing Astroneer, solve that immersion problem for you?

You do understand that not eating food adds alot of problems to your body. no stamina,lower motor skills,ect. thats why it adds immersion.

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8 minutes ago, finnrose said:

Ah, I see. I hope my answer provided a bit of that.

 

I think that many people who are fans of traditional sim and sandbox type games enjoy the hunger mechanic because it adds a challenge. For me, it's not necessarily the hunger itself but the gameplay that goes hand-in hand with it.

I understand the challenge part, but why does it have to be labeled 'hunger'? Cannot this same challenge be done with the existing oxygen and power and how it would be managed to make interesting gameplay? After all, at least so far, the developer's intent was to create an exploration game, not just another take on a farming sim. This is why I fleshed out my own arguments as saying that need for challenge can be fulfilled without just replicating a mechanic that has already been done multiple times in other games (with debateable results) already.

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1 minute ago, ent|ty said:

I understand the challenge part, but why does it have to be labeled 'hunger'? Cannot this same challenge be done with the existing oxygen and power and how it would be managed to make interesting gameplay? After all, at least so far, the developer's intent was to create an exploration game, not just another take on a farming sim. This is why I fleshed out my own arguments as saying that need for challenge can be fulfilled without just replicating a mechanic that has already been done multiple times in other games (with debateable results) already.

Isn't discovering exotic edibles on an alien planet part of exploration?

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2 minutes ago, finnrose said:

Isn't discovering exotic edibles on an alien planet part of exploration?

I dunno, is it? Explain.

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Just now, ent|ty said:

I dunno, is it? Explain.

Yes, it is. I think it's pretty self explanatory. It seems like you  just don't like the hunger mechanic because you find it annoying and are unwilling to accept anyone's reasoning for wanting it.

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4 minutes ago, finnrose said:

Yes, it is. I think it's pretty self explanatory. It seems like you  just don't like the hunger mechanic because you find it annoying and are unwilling to accept anyone's reasoning for wanting it.

Good convo. If you think that is my position, you haven't read this thread at all before responding.

Edited by ent|ty

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31 minutes ago, finnrose said:

Nope. It's not just hunger, it's food, farming and cultivation that goes along with the hunger. One of the biggest challenges of colonizing a planet is creating a renewable source of food and water.

Yes! This is also a space colonization game as well as a space exploration game. Currently in the game you can travel to other planets, explore the planet, then plop down a little habitat, set up a base, and go exploring again. They have already talked about possible indoor structures to add to your base so I could imagine a few plants or a farm being apart of that same suite. People look at hunger as a seeming annoyance to their exploration instead of the fact that it will enhance and expand their exploration options and capabilities. 

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1 minute ago, Baby Panda Jr, said:

Yes! This is also a space colonization game as well as a space exploration game. Currently in the game you can travel to other planets, explore the planet, then plop down a little habitat, set up a base, and go exploring again. They have already talked about possible indoor structures to add to your base so I could imagine a few plants or a farm being apart of that same suite. People look at hunger as a seeming annoyance to their exploration instead of the fact that it will enhance and expand their exploration options and capabilities. 

Exactly this.

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6 minutes ago, Baby Panda Jr, said:

 People look at hunger as a seeming annoyance to their exploration instead of the fact that it will enhance and expand their exploration options and capabilities. 

What game have you played that you think implemented this very well, and that you would like to see the same mechanics in Astroneer?

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6 minutes ago, Baby Panda Jr, said:

Yes! This is also a space colonization game as well as a space exploration game. Currently in the game you can travel to other planets, explore the planet, then plop down a little habitat, set up a base, and go exploring again. They have already talked about possible indoor structures to add to your base so I could imagine a few plants or a farm being apart of that same suite. People look at hunger as a seeming annoyance to their exploration instead of the fact that it will enhance and expand their exploration options and capabilities. 

^this +1 for good post

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Just now, ent|ty said:

What game have you played that you think implemented this very well, and that you would like to see the same mechanics in Astroneer?

minecraft,rust,7 days to die,dont starve,subnautica. all of these games have good food/explore ratio.

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4 minutes ago, PilotChan said:

minecraft,rust,7 days to die,dont starve,subnautica. all of these games have good food/explore ratio.

This. Though I have never played Minecraft. I was a huge Sims player for a long time. It wasn't the hunger that was fun but the means to satisfy hunger.

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"It feels like survival games are often built on a broken premise: the bulk of the player’s time is spent gathering food, water or other resources without much opportunity to break up the experience. Rather than engaging in interesting actions, players largely find themselves reacting to whatever gauge they need to refill the most." 

"Fast, always-draining resources are a source of continual stress, rather than tension."

"The speed with which these resources diminish places an undue focus on a play style that lacks variation as players must spend most of their time scavenging."

- Survival Game Shortcomings

I don't have a problem with survival, nor hunger, nor any challenge thrown at me in any game; I've played several survival games myself and am well aware of their impact on my gameplay, and how they ended up being in the long run, when other threats were introduced.

However, this mechanic has already been done. Instead of asking Astroneer to replicate every other game you have already played (offering nothing new), why not explore other options that will give you the same challenge, but with a fresh approach?

Does Astroneer need to serve a "The Sims" itch by requiring the astroneer to go to the bathroom on a regular basis? Is that fun? Do we want Astroneer to mimic 7 Days To Die, in the sense that you feel compelled to loot each and every box and bag  you can see just in order to grab a candy bar to fill your hunger bar? What part is fun while playing Miscreated, Day Z and other games - Is the searching of cabinets all day that engaging?

Is it really that fun to search cabins and pick at every cupboard door, open every drawer in the Long Dark when the sole purpose of the game is also to not starve? Does Astroneer need to be yet just another looting and feeding game?

I don't care either way, really. I'm just wondering where this whole obsession comes from hunger bars, and noone has really explained to me what they find so exciting about it.

"I love tinkering and tweaking and honing in on little details and being amazed or enthralled by things. In survival games, thirst and hunger tend to cut across that. There’s no space to wander and to enjoy or stretch out into the space because you tend to be scrambling around looking for wells and streams and sources of nutrition."  - Survival Games vs Pottering About (re: Subnautica)

 

Edited by ent|ty

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Pretty much all of the people I've seen expressing their opinion on the topic of hunger, it's been a staggering landslide"No to Hunger" majority, so idk why waste time on it, no one wants it.

Edited by valevma

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Darkest Dungeon actually has 'hunger' in it, but the way it implements it is very innovative and clever, and engaging, and never ends up adding tedium to the game.

A player must manage their use of food, should they use it? Should they dump it for room in their packs for treasure? Use it to heal now, or keep it for camp (In which they get good benefits for the rest of the dungeon).

If hunger is added, it shouldn't just be a bar you have to fill ever few minutes, and should offer gameplay that wouldn't already be covered with oxygen and energy, nor just replicate what already exists in other games (and presumably been played by many).

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2 minutes ago, valevma said:

Pretty much all of the people I've seen expressing their opinion on the topic of hunger, it's been a staggering landslide"No to Hunger" majority, so idk why waste time on it, no one wants it.

I guess I'm more interested in their thought process behind it, but it still remains unclear.

So far it's mostly "Because it should be" or "Because it shouldn't be". Not much help lol.

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