bigessess

New versions vs old save files, please update

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6 hours ago, BLEDHA said:

On the other side of things....

I am not sure if you work directly for SES or not (I don't know the staff roster) but I know you moderate - and this is not the way you should speak to clients who support a company through development even if they are being unrealistic and angry. Flippant and arrogant responses make the company seem like they don't give a darn, and justifies the further anger. If you are the (  or a) face of the company here, you shouldn't sink to the level of the anger and petulance of the customers, if you can't reason with them, brush them off and ignore. Otherwise you just fuel the fire. A modicum of professionalism goes a long way.

 

4 hours ago, vvhorus said:

1. Really? Are you going to go as low as to criticize my grammar? English is not my native language. Even though I've been bilingual most of my life, I do not claim to know all the nuances of the English language. Besides, going after my grammar does not contribute to the discussion, nor make your argument more or less valid than mine.

I apologize if you thought I meant to pick on this. I was merely pointing that that this phrase is commonly being misspelled, so that you will use it right in the future (btw English isn't my native language either, so I understand your issue, which is why I share the knowledge). Otherwise you say the opposite of what you intend to say.
And no, I am not an official SES employee. I am a volunteer moderator tasked with keeping the community clean from spam, insults and similar. Essentially, I am still a user like you, with my own opinion and interests. I like to chat with you guys on an even level, not a "I am trying to sell you something and tell you what you want to hear" level. So excuse any comments that may seem arrogant/mean, that's just my German. So again, I apologize.

4 hours ago, vvhorus said:

One more thing: I'm following your suggestion and not logging in to the game until an official announcement has been released stating that this issue has either been acknowledged by SES or has been resolved,

The issue has always been acknowledged. They said multiple times they try to keep saves as compatible as possible, but as long as the game is in heavy development, no promises to keep the saves absolutely stable can be made. They're absolutely aware that this has to be solved with v1.0 if they want to continue updating. Honestly, Terrain 2.0 is VERY likely to fix it.

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1 hour ago, Wyvyrias said:

Honestly, Terrain 2.0 is VERY likely to fix it.

i think this is the single feature we're all really giddy about (i know i am!)

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On 6/22/2018 at 5:14 PM, Wyvyrias said:

The phrase goes "I couldn't care less. I wonder why people keep saying the opposite.

Oh how I have tried to explain that concept to people. I am not alone afterall

 

On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

The save system right now is not perfect, and never is going to be perfect. I'm not a game developer, I'm just a software developer.

If you were my developer, and I heard you say that, I would discontinue your employment.

On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

The save system right now is not perfect, and never is going to be perfect.

All I can say to that statement is to reread where you quoted me saying I am not asking for perfection. What in the world are you trying to tell me?

On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

How many … How many … … ...

I can tell by the questions you asked and the assumptions that followed them that you would not make a pimple on a developers back side

 

? Where oh where has the topic of my thread gone.. I will need boots to find my way out of here

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34 minutes ago, bigessess said:

If you were my developer, and I heard you say that, I would discontinue your employment.

Why? Do you understand a bit of what I said before and after that? If my boss comes and fires me for saying that, well, better for me. That boss has not a single idea about software development and project management, much less about people management, not at all. He is just a moron. There is a fine line understanding between achievable goals and unrealistic expectations. If that boss is incapable of doing that... I'm fine with being fired. 

45 minutes ago, bigessess said:

All I can say to that statement is to reread where you quoted me saying I am not asking for perfection. What in the world are you trying to tell me?

Now, that is funny, I quoted you, but I never addressed you. If I were your boss and you demonstrate this lack of reading skills, I'd discontinue your employment... or something like that ?. Before that quotation I said: "Now, what you understand for viable may be just enough, as bigessess said:". I just used (quoted) what you said because vvhorus wanted a perfect save system. I was talking to vvhorus, not to you. 

58 minutes ago, bigessess said:

I can tell by the questions you asked and the assumptions that followed them that you would not make a pimple on a developers back side

I don't know how to answer this. First, I don't know what I did to you for you  to be this dismissive. Second, unless you come here and show me WHY my assumptions were incorrect and imprecise, your words mean absolute nothing. I can play with you and humor you and talk back at you, but I don't even know what are your capabilities nor your education, it would be meaningless. It would be like two small kids fighting about nothing. Third, you have proof that the developers didn't expected for that dirtball to be cut in half. You have a pretty picture of that moon being torn apart but there is no indication in the UI about that. And that is fine, why they should? Trying to come up with a solution for that is a waste of resources, resources that can be better spent in making the game better and more stable. Same with the save system, expecting a "perfect" save system is a waste of resources. They just have to make something good enough. 

 

1 hour ago, bigessess said:

Where oh where has the topic of my thread gone.. I will need boots to find my way out of here

Or a shuttle, I think it be thematically better. 

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1 hour ago, bigessess said:

Where oh where has the topic of my thread gone.. I will need boots to find my way out of here

the topic's been the same: the impossibility of a game under intensive and active development keeping old versions viable. it's not gonna happen, period. forward development slows considerably once the aspect of "don't wreck old saves" comes into play. you don't want to slow down development during the *alpha* stage of a game. you hold the backwards-compatibility crap on the backburner until the game's released. if you want to start one world, and play only that one world for the rest of all time, then you seriously are better off waiting for 1.0 or possibly even 2.0. i'm not even being sarcastic or cheeky; your initial complaint, the very first post in this thread, is that of someone who doesn't really understand the development process. it's great that you enjoy the game and all, but we've tied up a ton of time and forum space debating a thing that will only ever be an early-access issue which will disappear once the game's not alpha anymore. there's no 'if' here, saves WILL carry over across updates when the core of the game itself is settled and isn't being changed every update. every other game in history has had the same issue, and every other game in history has settled out post-alpha. astroneer will too. 

expecting 'stable' saves-across-updates right now is just foolish, not even a AAA title would offer that much this early

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On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

How do you expect that share amount of variables to be predicted every single patch to obtain a perfect recovery save system that adapts to the modification of the save file?

 

On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

What they can do is to try to adjust the models the best they can, and that is it.

 

On 6/22/2018 at 10:25 PM, Chepelink said:

 Expect to have problems once in a while

This is why:

There is no way to procedurally generate what I did to the planet. What rocks my boat is I never asked for a fix of the map, just attention to future save files. This is a poor assumption.

...adjust the models the best they can... again your 1920's attitude that software is forever full of bugs. Most games have achieved stable save files, this one will too. Why do you assume not, do you know something I do not about it? This is a poor assumption.

...Again, I do expect it to have problems. I dare you to read my first post and then see where the rest of this thread has gone. It is a truck load of crap and I am just piling on top now lol

 

On 6/24/2018 at 6:40 AM, 101101110111 said:

expecting 'stable' saves-across-updates right now is just foolish,

I will direct you too to my first post, the original post of this thread, dare tell where I expect anything. It is this attitude that should never have popped its head in this thread, this is not what this was about. The animals have taken it to the woods for play, never to return.

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3 minutes ago, bigessess said:

There is no way to procedurally generate what I did to the planet. What rocks my boat is I never asked for a fix of the map, just attention to future save files

they tell you every single patch so far that it WILL have compatibility problems. expect that until 1.0 at the very earliest. for the time being, all that happens when they attempt compatibility is cripple development. goddamn do i feel like a broken record by this point...

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more persistent saves WILL happen once they've got the core game ironed out. as i'd ALSO pointed out before, persistence is WAYYYYYYYY down the list of priorities during ALPHA phase. 

to reiterate for the 239587th time: *do not*, and i mean *don't ever* expect a game during alpha phase to have any sort of backward compatibility after updates. no programmer could be paid enough to waste their time on that aspect when there's thousands of other things to focus on. 

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idk… I gave an introduction statement that describes the problem briefly... followed that with a good list type summary of specific details related to the report... and closed with a screenshot demonstrating the problem like I do with any other bug I report. But suddenly this one is a hot spot on everyone's front burner for some reason, and I do like a good fire. Im in it for the fun. How far do we go lol

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2 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

to reiterate for the 239587th time: *do not*, and i mean *don't ever* expect

to reiterate for the 239588th time I *did not*, and I mean *did not ever* say the word EXPECT in any way lol

your turn

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it's not a bug report though... it's an extremely well-known issue (the devs even TELL you it'll happen). the core of the game changes, older saves will be slogged when they try to integrate with the new core. start a new save. start 100 new saves. broken record again: if the problem happens in your NEW saves, and not a *known to be deprecated* save, then it's a bug. if it doesn't happen, then all you did was prove what the devs already TOLD you would happen. 

i don't see what's so troublesome about this concept, the rest of us are already on board with the "new update = new worlds" train, knowing old worlds will have old bugs that aren't worth reporting because they're OLD bugs that probably don't exist in new updates.

Edited by 101101110111

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You are right, it is not a bug report, I missed and posted in the suggestions forum, maybe someone will notice and move it, to the trash where it belongs now.

On a side note, it is not my responsibility to read what the devs TELL you, nor is it one to post here. The game asked to post things here, and so I did. Now, if no one posted that they would like to start keeping save files, then maybe the devs think no one cares. Again, not my responsibility to find out if they already know, I left them message where they asked me to, so...back to topic

I bet in the 3 or so weeks I have played, I have started and deleted more save files than any 5 people combined in 3 months play time each. I might even win that bet against some of their own devs/testers....its what I do because it is fun to me, far past 100

So on the tech side, some of the specifics I posted could be easily prevented in the recovery of an earlier save. Now, I am not one of the devs, do not know them, and know nothing about this specific game, but the objects that are intruding on my base are in some grouping of some sort that get placed about the terrain in some manner.... now when an old save file is loaded in a new vesion, and this can always be detected by giving the new version something the old ones do not have, and lacking this item means it is an outdated save...now that we know it is old, we can simply let it run as normal, and just before we let the character enter to play, do a quick check on placed tables and habitats and pads, remove any of those bad objects which do not belong because the range is too close to a player placed object, and roll on from there. Now that would be a simple few lines of code to add that almost any programmer on the team could implement... just my $0.02

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4 minutes ago, bigessess said:

Now that would be a simple few lines of code to add that almost any programmer on the team could implement

that's the kind of crap that's best saved for when they're NOT focused on actually improving the game. 100% chance they already have persistence on the backburner, but it's not worth implementing yet among the 239872 other things that *need* to be worked on. they won't ever get proper bug reports if everybody's playing on old saves. it'll be a mishmash of "compatibility error" and "real bug". and that cripples development while they try to sort the pair out. that's why they highly recommend starting new saves with new updates. and that'll continue to be the case as long as the game's alpha: that would be the case with ANY game in alpha. i could rattle off a list of games i played during alpha/beta where your progress was *forcibly* reset every update. you had no choice to play an older version, you were shot straight back to the beginning simply because they updated one or 2 tiny things. we kinda have it easy here that we CAN retain older worlds, broken or not. you're just no good for the bug hunt if you choose to stay back in the dust instead of moving forward too; you'll be reporting imaginary bugs

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10 minutes ago, bigessess said:

 Now that would be a simple few lines of code to add that almost any programmer on the team could implement... just my $0.02

Now please take this out of the context of this thread, which has become a little antagonistic, but what are your qualifications? You're writing  authoritatively so I just want to put that in context. Very plainly and dispassionately. 

Again, I understand you're coming from the technical feasibility standpoint rather than the 'paying customer expecting perfection'. 

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16 minutes ago, bigessess said:

There is no way to procedurally generate what I did to the planet. What rocks my boat is I never asked for a fix of the map, just attention to future save files. This is a poor assumption.

If I remember correctly I didn't use the phrase "fix the map" or anything closer to it. If I said something around fixing something it would be under a particular context. You have to put things under the context that were used at the moment of saying it. Talking about poor assumptions. Now, you may say, "I never said that you said", but I have to disagree, you are addressing me and quoting me, thus it is a fair assumption that you were talking about what I said. If not, please, said so. Context matter.

35 minutes ago, bigessess said:

again your 1920's attitude that software is forever full of bugs

The more complex the code/program is, the harder to keep it bug free. And I think that you are smart enough to realize this. If I said something around the lines of "there is always to be a problem/bug/issue" is because of context. Maybe someone was expecting a 100% or something... don't you think? And not, it wasn't you.It was certain paying customer.

 

40 minutes ago, bigessess said:

Most games have achieved stable save files, this one will too

If you are sure about this, that this game will too... why the thread? Why don't just wait for it to happen?

 

42 minutes ago, bigessess said:

Why do you assume not, do you know something I do not about it?

Point me out where do I assume that you don't know about something, and I mean when I said something between the lines of "you don't know...". Particularly when I literally wrote "I don't even know what are your capabilities nor your education". What I may said was to point out information, because I cannot assume that you know something, too (thus, I'm always in a bind to write the pertinent information). 

47 minutes ago, bigessess said:

...Again, I do expect it to have problems.

You quote me saying "Expect to have problems once in a while". Again, context. First, I didn't said that to you, did I? Second, you agree with me, thus, umm,  what?  I don't get it. 

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34 minutes ago, bigessess said:

something the old ones do not have, and lacking this item means it is an outdated save

If it were so simple as to know what is lacking, that would be solved long ago. There are things like changes in the world generator, terrain generator, changes in the hit boxes of the terrain, of the objects, etc, that makes this an extremely difficult task. There is a saying around in my work and it says "To fix 99.5% of the bugs can cost $100,000 and 1 year of work, to fix the remaining 0.5% could cost hundreds of millions and 1,000 years". 

34 minutes ago, bigessess said:

Now that would be a simple few lines of code to add that almost any programmer on the team could implement... just my $0.02

Now that is an extremely poor assumption. As in, you would have a better chance to assume what are the numbers for the next lottery than hitting on that.

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43 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

that's the kind of crap that's best saved for when they're NOT focused on actually improving the game.

For a game that builds on a save file over time, improving loading old save files is actually improving the game. sooo….one player said please do... not just please do but.. specifically, listen now.. "less destructive" … Where do you people get these 100%, perfect, and exact from? I never suggested any such thing. Nor did I suggest any form of attempt to recover what was broken. This is all just stuff that was thrown in over time.

 

46 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

but it's not worth implementing yet

For the player who posted the thread, and those who agreed, it is worth implementing yet. You just have your own opinion, and this was not the place to share it.

 

48 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

they won't ever get proper bug reports if everybody's playing on old saves

Everyone is not playing on old saves though. I have old and delete a few every day. This was, at one point, a decent bug report. The fact that some people feel this is a non-issue to them makes them feel the need to voice the assumed opinion of the devs… or something like that, I do not honestly know what drives you. Your attempt to disqualify some players needs in favor of your own does not mean the devs want to destroy old save files. Maybe a decent description of some things that could be addressed in a short manner of time, that would greatly improve loading old saves (as this seems to be not only the main issue, but in a general manner it is all just that one simple issue for my saves anyway) would be worth the time spent not just for the players who already want to load old saves, but for the others who might one day want to also.

On another side note, I never give this 'bug report' (as I will call it) any more push of importance than any other bug, in fact, it is the first one where I used the word please... lol w/e

54 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

i could rattle off a list of games i played

...and that would be quite irrelevant to this, as we are discussing ...specifically... this very game individually on a singleton basis..... this very exact one right here lol SO... anything can happen and the way to get that to happen is to post your wants and desires where the devs asked you to. so I did.

 

56 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

you're just no good for the bug hunt if you choose to stay back in the dust instead of moving forward too; you'll be reporting imaginary bugs

I refer you back to my previous statement on how many save files a day I delete. I test more things than some testers. You, who only tests the new stuff, and ignores a wonderful part of this game, called save files, you are the one who is no good for the bug hunt, you do not have a definition of the hunting grounds yet.

 

58 minutes ago, 101101110111 said:

if you choose to stay back in the dust

this is a portion of the hunting grounds you are missing. for some people's play style, (the group activity group effort end game) this IS the whole game, and they paid their money like the rest.. I just enjoy bug hunting new games for the thrill of the things computers can do when you tell them to.... I saw a huge dynamite that just makes me laugh every time I think about it.

I play and test new and old files, why is that an issue?

58 minutes ago, Blind Io said:

but what are your qualifications?

 

1 hour ago, bigessess said:

Now, I am not one of the devs, do not know them, and know nothing about this specific game

….but I mean, what does that mean. I just want to load an old save file without new objects sharing the 3D space with my toys... it is not fun to remove them. But if this game is maintained in an object oriented manner.. lol and it is (I could be wrong).. then what I said about the fix for the things I reported is probably fairly accurate... again I know nothing of this game design at all... I could be wrong. That is why I did not suggest a fix, I just requested one. Because I (and seemingly others) want to use a save file over time to continue to build on. The fact that the game is not at that point yet does not mean we should not say what we want. If old saves is more important to some players than adding new stuff or fixing ground tears, then let them say that in peace. Make a thread that requests the features you would like to see rather than trying to belittle others' desires.

1 hour ago, Chepelink said:

If I remember correctly I didn't use the phrase "fix the map" or anything closer to it.

you said: How do you expect that share amount of variables to be predicted every single patch to obtain a perfect recovery save system that adapts to the modification of the save file?

its the part where you said perfect recovery save system that adapts to the modification of the save file... see right there, that part is what was closer to it, that was it..

1 hour ago, Chepelink said:

If I said something around the lines of "there is always to be a problem/bug/issue"

What you said was about the save system not being perfect, and never will be. Of course it will be. Why would you assume some software can never be perfect, more specifically, a part of a full program, not even the whole thing... many games have done this, why would you say this game will never do it?

 

1 hour ago, Chepelink said:

If you are sure about this, that this game will too... why the thread? Why don't just wait for it to happen?

The devs probably do not roll dice or throw darts to decide what to do next. I am under the impression that they do, at some point, take the opinions on this forum into consideration, because they said so many times. Load as many new games as I have and you will have that image stuck in your head and burned into your screen.

 

1 hour ago, Chepelink said:

Point me out where do I assume that you don't know about something

I was only asking if you held some secret, not that you had said something about me. You held a firm assumption that this game would never have perfect save files, and I want to know what drives your opinion so strongly. Do you in fact know some secret?

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45 minutes ago, Chepelink said:

If it were so simple as to know what is lacking, that would be solved long ago.

That was just on the fly generalization of a possible solution... that would work in a generic scenario... I am just pointing out that I only asked for it to be "less destructive" and listed some things that in my opinion may be fairly easy to fix, which I could be wrong. But I am probably not. again my guess lol

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yes, please keep quoting while deleting the context. 99.9% of players in an alpha... ok, i'm done being a looped phrase for you. either realize you're playing a game that WILL break saves every update, or move on to a bigger title that's actually finished. come back here when it's the latter, and stop wasting everybody's time with imaginary bugs

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6 minutes ago, bigessess said:

 

….but I mean, what does that mean. I just want to load an old save file without new objects sharing the 3D space with my toys... it is not fun to remove them. But if this game is maintained in an object oriented manner.. lol and it is (I could be wrong).. 

I really am truly sorry, but I asked a specific question. You're talking in broad-stroke terms and I just want to understand where you're coming from. Are you a 50yr old dev at a AAA studio, a 20-something with some coding experience, or a teenager arguing for kicks?

Without this kind of context, most of what you're arguing isn't valid. 

I tried to be clear that I'm only looking for clarification in terms of the debate that really doesn't involve me. I've made my position clear very briefly. 

I'm not attacking you, I'm not part of the two or three people mocking you, I'm asking what're you bringing to the table. 

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7 hours ago, bigessess said:

its the part where you said perfect recovery save system that adapts to the modification of the save file... see right there, that part is what was closer to it, that was it..

That is not even close to fixing the map, as in, the map is broken so put a program to try to revert it to a previous state. In the first place, the save of an old patch is not broken nor corrupted per-se, thus nothing is wrong with the save. The problem is the loading of that file. Now when I talked about complexity and prediction I mean in it under the context of loading the save file. 

Now, before I delve into this, you have to understand that we already have a very stable save/load system. In this state it can probably be launch to the public. I mean, with the several hour games that you have played, you should have saved and load many, many times. How many of those times did you have problems that does not involved a new patch, specially in the latest iterations? I surely hasn't have any problems yet. Can it be improved? Of course!!!

Now, if we already have a stable save/load system in place, what happens when the patches occur? Well, for sure is not the save system, it is the load system. And to be precise, is the rendering/rebuilding of the world that is the problem, in most cases. I'll going to exemplify one of many possible things that could happen for a save to be loaded badly, there are others like the physics engine adjustments. 

As you may be aware, when you load the game, the game needs to rebuild the world. It first have to create the land (or the planets, as you see fit), later it has to place the objects and later the player. Obviously it is an over simplification and the order might not be exactly like that because of optimization, but it is a good start. Now the load engine of the game have a set of instructions on how to rebuild the planets and their land (surface). And the save file has the details that make the rebuild possible. You can think it in terms of languages... the load system (including rendering and so on and so forth) has to have the same language that the save file has in order to load it correctly. But, when a new patch arrives, they change the language of the load system. Fair enough, it is a similar language, but it is not the same. Thus, the load system has to try to translate the old language, fill the gaps and try to make adjustments. But sometimes, something get lost or misplaced in the translation, and when that happens you know what happens. Now, the translator is not a built functionality inherent of the save system. You can have a stable save system without a translator, they just don't have to change the language between patches and there you go. But that would mean no new biomes, no new terrain objects, planets, and so forth. They could try to add a translator, but it is not easy to correctly translate something.

Now, lets talk a bit about the translator. In order to translate they have to try to predict how the changes in the language is going to affect the old file (inter alias). This is the part where I talked about complexity and possibilities. How many forms do you think that a player can put an object on the ground? Or the capability of that player to cut in half a planet (I'm still amazed for that feat, it was so cool). That just make the translation process even harder, to try to predict such behavior. Without player input, the process could be way less complex, they don't need to think about a seed of a plant to be placed on the unmodifiable ground because the rules of the world don't allow it.

8 hours ago, bigessess said:

What you said was about the save system not being perfect, and never will be. Of course it will be. Why would you assume some software can never be perfect, more specifically, a part of a full program, not even the whole thing... many games have done this, why would you say this game will never do it?

8 hours ago, bigessess said:

I was only asking if you held some secret, not that you had said something about me. You held a firm assumption that this game would never have perfect save files, and I want to know what drives your opinion so strongly. Do you in fact know some secret?

I wrote this: "To fix 99.5% of the bugs can cost $100,000 and 1 year of work, to fix the remaining 0.5% could cost hundreds of millions and 1,000 years" in a later post addressed at you. That is the secret that I know. Just google about programmers jokes and you would find things like:

"99 little bugs in the code.
99 little bugs in the code.
Take one down, patch it around.

120 little bugs in the code."

The more complex a program is, the more lines a program have, the higher the chances of having bugs, the slower the process to find them, and chances for those changes to affect what they have done appear. But that is not all, the players want content patches. this mean, continue the iterative process of putting more lines in the code, creating more bugs in the process. Now, what do you think is more likely, that the devs try to reach perfection in a timely manner with enough resources and money to be considered a successful game, or to reach perfection without the later? If they  reach perfection  in a timely manner with enough resources and money to be considered a successful game, perfect. But try to guess the probabilities for that to happen, including the fact that they are still going to add content and improve the game.

8 hours ago, bigessess said:

The devs probably do not roll dice or throw darts to decide what to do next. I am under the impression that they do, at some point, take the opinions on this forum into consideration, because they said so many times. Load as many new games as I have and you will have that image stuck in your head and burned into your screen.

I just pointed out a contradiction in your actions. You put the thread in the suggestion section (by accident or otherwise), suggesting that you want them to pay attention to it, while at the same time, knowing that they are going to do it. Whatever you do, do it. If you think that would help, go on. I just point it that out. 

8 hours ago, Blind Io said:

I'm not attacking you, I'm not part of the two or three people mocking you, I'm asking what're you bringing to the table. 

I hope that I'm not in that count. I usually don't mock unless they mock me first. 

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12 hours ago, 101101110111 said:

either realize

I realized that before I started the thread. That is why it is so funny to see all this... what ever it is you are trying to do... you realize you are aiming at the wrong person with your posts. Go back to the first post in this thread, and respond to me from that only... that is this ...no. that was this thread's point. That has been my point all along.

 

3 hours ago, Chepelink said:

the save of an old patch is not broken nor corrupted per-se

Yes, it is. See the attached photo and the short description in the first post. This was the point of the post to begin with. It IS in fact broken.

 

3 hours ago, Chepelink said:

very stable save/load system

and my request was for it to be … and I do quote me directly... "less destructive", not perfect, not 100%, not exact

 

3 hours ago, Chepelink said:

As you may be aware, when you load the game, the game needs to rebuild the world

I refer this to the generic fix, I am not aware but I assume so, yes. Again, in reading the generic fix, you can see that the things listed are things that could potentially be fixed fairly easy. Even if updating an old save took another couple passes and some extra time, it would be a one time operation that may be worth 30 - 60 seconds extra one time...

3 hours ago, Chepelink said:

to fix the remaining 0.5%

ya ya ya, everyone gets the moral of that story, my map was not 0.5% broken, I would rate it at 30% broken because every developed place on the planet was ruined.

 

3 hours ago, Chepelink said:

suggesting that you want them to pay attention to it

The point of a forum? Specifically what the devs asked the players to do? lol This is the fuel that drives me to continue this thread. Even when I said it was off topic and had been derailed with numbers, people kept on with the 100%, perfect, and exact stuff... not at all. 

 

12 hours ago, Blind Io said:

Are you a 50yr old dev at a AAA studio, a 20-something with some coding experience, or a teenager arguing for kicks? 

Without this kind of context, most of what you're arguing isn't valid...

…., I'm asking what're you bringing to the table

Do I have to be one of the above, or something different, for you to consider what I am arguing valid? How are these things related? If a teenager arguing for kicks reported a legit problem with a game, is his argument less valid than a 50 yr old dev at a AAA studio? Is the bug different for the two players? Do the two players deserve a different level of respect in a bug report or a different number of hours of development working on the reported problem?

I brought attention to something that I noticed, something that many players do not like, and according to the posts here something that is a popular hot topic for many others. Not only did I mention it but I listed specific details and included a screenshot showing what was described. Then when the thread kept veering off to the left I even attempted to put it back on track, lol, more than once. It has been in full train wreck mode for the last page now

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15 minutes ago, bigessess said:

 

Do I have to be one of the above, or something different, for you to consider what I am arguing valid? 

You're suggesting this issue is such an easy fix for the devs, I'm just interested as to why. By avoiding the question twice, you've kind of answered my question. 

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15 minutes ago, Blind Io said:

By avoiding the question twice

I did not avoid it, I labeled it irrelevant and dismissed it as such. Did you ask it twice? idk, I can not promise that I pay attention as I read when people get off topic. If you want to know me IRL, then I suggest first you meet me IRL, then you can get personal, maybe..

I only suggest, that it might be... a fairly easy fix... But I specifically said I know none of the devs and nothing of the implementation of this specific game and that my assumptions were guesses and could be wrong. If you fail to understand that, idk what I can do to help.

Having said all of that, my assumptions are still probably correct...

Dare you to answer the questions in my last post however... those seem perfectly relevant to this conversation... fill in those blanks for me

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16 minutes ago, bigessess said:

I only suggest, that it might be... a fairly easy fix... But I specifically said I know none of the devs and nothing of the implementation of this specific game and that my assumptions were guesses and could be wrong. If you fail to understand that, idk what I can do to help.

if it was an easy fix to keep saves from deprecating during active development, it wouldn't be a problem. instead, it has been and will be a problem in *every piece of software that goes through a development process*. ergo, it's not an easy fix. it's quite valid for people to want to pull rank and find out what sort of background you have that makes you feel like you're some sort of expert in this, because the rest of us apparently understand these things better than you do. we certainly didn't need to have the concept of alpha-phase sledgehammered into our skulls

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